Postcapitalist Desire, Melancholy, Psychedelia and Mark Fisher:
XG on Interdependence with Mat Dryhurst and Holly Herndon

Shortly before Christmas, I had a really lovely evening chatting with Mat Dryhurst and Holly Herndon on their excellent podcast, Interdependence. Having been a fan for many, many years, it was a little bit terrifying but Holly and Mat are such engaged and passionate hosts, it was a real joy to chat with them. In fact, this might be my favourite public conversation I’ve yet had around Mark’s work.

It feels weird to be posting this on the anniversary of Mark’s death, but to borrow from an earlier Twitter thread

I’ve been thinking a lot, ever since Egress came out, about Mark’s adage that “all that is solid melts into PR” and I cringe under waves of discomfort when I feel my own relationship to Mark and my own engagement with his work being infected by the virus of commercialism. This is not intention but something of an occupational hazard — in becoming occupied by Mark’s legacy, the further distribution of his thought becomes entangled with capitalist modes of distribution. As such, I really cherish the moments when that structure of sharing and exchange is broken down into something more informal. That is what I love about this episode of Interdependence, even listening back myself — how quickly we fall into talking about Mark and his work as fans more than anything.

In that respect, it feels like a lovely sentiment to share today, four years on. Though Mark’s death wavers as this oddly abstract event, no longer immediate in its impact, his work still feels as present and alive as it ever did, and I’m humbled to have a part in sharing it with you — today especially.

You can listen to the entire episode for free over on and, if you enjoy our chat, consider signing up to Mat and Holly’s Patreon here.

1 Comment

Leave a Reply